[Community] FYI 2013 Nexus 7 reviewed
kardan at riseup.net
Mon Aug 12 07:07:43 CEST 2013
will the phone be ready until november? We all want to see the bird to
take off! Please comment on the following friendly advices.
On Sun, 11 Aug 2013 11:02:01 +0200
"Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller" <hns at goldelico.com> wrote:
> Hi kardan,
> Am 11.08.2013 um 10:42 schrieb kardan:
> > may this be of interest for compareism. which features of the
> > following would you like to have in a open hardware phone/tablet?
> I think everybody would agree to get
> >= feature-set(Nexus 7) + 100% open
> <= price(Nexus 7)
> <= min(release_date(Nexus7), release_date(iPad+1))
Maybe someone could dissolve those values.
> The question is less what we want to have, it is how we can get there.
Below I stated some thoughts on a strategy to get there.
> Enthusiasm isn't enough any more as the Ubuntu Edge campaign
> appears to demonstrate.
I am not familiar to that one. Could you please add details (maybe
for others on the list as well).
> > Cheaper than most, better than all: the 2013 Nexus 7 reviewed
> Currently we are on the torture rack where feature level of mainstream
> devices is going up and prices are going down (leading to increasing
> financial loss for big companies).
At a first glimpse this sounds like market implosion later on.
People are getting used to get all for nothing (/few) which is
similarly for information and services on the web. There will be some
kind of awaking that "no cost" for customers means high costs at
another part of the chain - for the web it is to realize every user is
a product sold to ad/spam factories for example - for hardware it is
also about privacy at some point (which people will realize soon /
partly did already), but not only as there are several more "real"
drawbacks like working conditions, economic destruction, war on
resources, political interference by US/EU, nuclear radiation,
pollution, you name it ..
Our phone campaign CAN be the answer to all of these questions, if we
manage to outreach a majority of customers (see my thoughts on a
marketing campaign below).
> So the key question we all have is how we can get out of that
I think first of all you need to be clear why the Phoenix is better than
the fairphone, as they are doing exactly the right things in my eyes.
Then imagine I am a manager of a small hardware company (like the one
below) who is looking for potential clients. I am open for
environmentally friendly production and care about human rights and
heard about your open source company in a podcast/whatever.
I go to goldelico.com and look for OpenPhoenix as it was named to be
a new phone project. It is not there. (put images of all
successfull products to your front page!) I click on "Open hardware
projects". I see a some mac banners and have the feeling your company
is for a limited audience (i have no clue what GNUstep is, but I heard
people of GNU shouting about the software I use). Thoug I wonder why
the projects are not listed on the projects page. Patiently I click on
the link to http://projects.goldelico.com
Ugh, I am confused. There are only software projects and I want
to leave as this company does not seem to do anything my hardware.
But still I scroll down and finally see "OpenPhoenux
Open Pho(n)e (w. Li)nux - The independent Open Mobile Tool community
Labels: n/a". Mh, still no hint for open hardware, but phone sounds
good. As it is not listed at the top I assume it may be one your minor
projets. And finally http://projects.goldelico.com/p/openphoenux/ does
not change this impression - no call for hardware vendors or fair
suppliers. As I am clever I scroll down again and click on hardware.
Now I am lost what this is about and leave.
So it is worth to optimize the page for hardware vendors who are
interested to sell to you or even would make a better price in exchange
for a logo on your front page for example .. I would do that for you,
but I am loaded with own (hardware) projects currently.
What of the following is missing and prevents GTA04 to boom?
2) customers / preorders
3) financial calculations
5) marketing material
6) marketing campaign
7) employees / personnel / contributors / hat wearers
8) user comfort
Which are missing?
What do you think are the reasons that keep your bird on the ground?
From my perspective it is about 4) 2) 5) (in this order).
So a first start would be
A collect info that everybody should know about
B outline a process for a multi-cycle crowdfunding campaign
C offer an easy way for interests to get a) involved b) a usable phone.
* phone properties
** price expectations
* unique selling propositions (USP)
=> completely open phone (100% software, 100% hardware)
=> privacy enhancements
=> fair labour conditions for production and assembly
=> clean resources (beyond war areas / human rights violations)
=> open process - everybody can join in and contribute
=> what else?
(If you have the feeling, the above is not true, it turns out 1) is
incomplete. In this case better get to work before asking for 2) 4).)
For me not all questions are answered, please share your knowledge.
Also it should be worth to have a deeper look at MakeItFair  and the
requirements they make for hardware and processes.
Also maybe our perspectives differ regarding priorities.
B) multi-cycle crowdfunding campaign
* register openphoenix.[org|com]
* setup a blog about all current progress (i offer my help with design)
* promote the Phoenix drectly at goldelico.com
* collect all info information from above
* compress it to a leaflet and spread it <- MOST important atm IMHO
* connect and link to all other open hardware initiatives
** for example this campaign  for an open source Geiger counter 
-target are 1000 pieces á 20€ - what about co-promotion?
* use all steps you are working on for promotion on the blog
* target: 1000 phones / 1 million €
* test round as prove of concept for hardware and to equip
software developers with a working device and for advertising the
project at exhibitions of course
* if you think, there are more potential developers, please tell
* mind administrators as valuable group for testing and helping
developers in gathering information
* this phase should be funded by prospective users / some sponsor(s)
* think of billionaires who should be convinced to fund the project
* target: 10.000 / 5 million €
* crowdfunding campaign for limited preorder with useful peripheral
equiment, fancy stories, nice gadgets like the PiGi, freedombox etc.
* setup a foundation for open mobile communication
* target: who wil now :)
At this point I would like to throw in my answers to your thoughts about
fair hardware from april (which I was not able to perceive earlier).
On Tue, 9 Apr 2013 11:21:35 +0200
"Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller" <hns at goldelico.com> wrote:
> Am 08.04.2013 um 10:12 schrieb Sebastian Beschke:
>> as Nikolaus recently asked for visions regarding future incarnations
>> of OpenPhoenux, I would like to bring up the topic of a fair,
>> sustainable and transparent supply chain.
> As you write above: "it is very hard even for device makers to be
> certain what exactly is in their devices in terms of fairness."
> So I doubt that we as a small community project can do it better. The
> reason is that we have no "buying power" to request more transparency
> from our suppliers.
We can and we will. Don't name our community small or it becomes
smaller. Our aims are legitimate and necessary, our approach is the
right one and we are able to convince any sane human (not deceived by
money games) that an open (not free :) phone with respect for workers
and environment is the only acceptable way to go.
> They do not value us as a signifiant customer and before they invest
> into finding out (or even improving their own supply chain), they
> will refuse to keep us as customers. This will only change if they
> themselves see it as a good marketing argument for *all* of their
> customers (not only us).
What is your forecast at which number THEY (do you refer to supplyers
for main parts or periphery components) will take us important enough?
I would start with smaller companies (if their prices may be higher)
how understand their benefit to become well known as fair supplier.
> Maybe even a cooperation with some other open minded companies would
> be imagineable?
> Like reusing Efika's iMX6 board:
Maybe it's worth to ask corporate [at] genesi-tech.com for
specifications. "Genesi supports software developer communities through
Power Developer and other operating system/distribution specific
websites. Genesi also funds and operates power2people, a non-profit
organization focused on fostering the development and sharing of
information and communication technologies."
"Power2People is a non-profit organization incorporated in Texas, USA.
Our mission is to provide comprehensive, low-cost, state-of-the-art
communications and collaboration services to emerging communities. The
ultimate aim is to grow the local economy rapidly thereby improving
quality of life for the community through better education, health care
and living standards."
> Final assembly is done here in Munich by one of two potential
> companies and from them we know that the employees are not jumping
> out of the windows (but they use Windows)...
Well, in respect to humanity let's not make this a requirement but give
them a chance to choose. :)
> The key question will be how much a "fair" OpenPhoenux increases the
> cost for such devices. And how much this can be compensated by higher
> demand by being "fair".
I see it the other way round: We make the requirement for fair
production as we know it is necessary and customers will appreciate
this. There is a need to feed. Imagine on the radio you hear of a new
phone, that is
* good to you by enabling for complete control over hard~ and software
* good to workers by respecting their rights and paying proper loans
* good to environment using clean resources and minimizing production
* has fancy easy to use software with charming workflows
Whould you buy it? I would and most people out there as well. This is
what I strongly believe and as I can convince you, we will inspire
> It may turn out like with Android and iOS that 99,9% of the world
> population will think those are already "open" enough and buy the
> cheapest variant they can get their hands on.
Don't make such assumptions, it would limit (y)our freedom. We ARE
the 99% - let's focus on how to involve more people lowering (skill)
> Of course this attitude deserves to be worked against to secure the
> future of mankind.
Thank you for saying so!
> Another point to consider is the pure number of components. We have
> approx. 250 components from at least 50 different brands. Who is
> willing to do the work to research and track that initially and in
> the future?
Please provide us with links of all the information you have and we will
put our knowledge around it. Ideally in a wiki.
Don't question if anybody is willing to do it. OpenSource and
Crowdsourcing have proven that if anything is necessary to achieve a
goal, it will be done, no matter by whom, how many people, in how many
steps. We will get through it by the means of emergence.
Just to set you on the track
* GSM is insecure we don't want to use it
("GSM only authenticates the user to the network (and not vice
versa)", "it is possible to break A5/2 in real-time with a
ciphertext-only attack", "FPGAs that allow A5/1 to be broken with a
rainbow table attack", "it is possible to build "a full GSM
interceptor...from open-source components"" -> WP:GSM)
* There will be a successor anyway, so better it is developed by the
community than some agencies.
* conventional mobile network operators are not attractive for use with
open phones - we either need our own communication infrastructure
or think of completely different ways to switch phone calls to IP.
So there is a lot to learn:
(If you think this is impossible because of legal restrictions, well,
we need to get rid of them as well - following the line forth..)
Take me for crazy or join the thinking on long term management.
> > Great screen, fast internals make this refreshed tablet a great
> > deal at any price.
> > http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/07/the-2013-nexus-7-review-meet-the-new-standard-for-android-tablets/
> it is not necessary to copy the full article - and it might violate
> copyrights doing so.
right .. copyright. I often forget about this one. :)
> I think it is completely sufficient to insert the link.
I got used to backup web pages to text if possible due to internet
blackouts and readering comfort, web spying, etc. But ok.
I can't stress the point enough, that our problem is not solved by
applying capitalism but maybe we can learn from methods used by big
players (while there are essential drawbacks by focusing on profit).
I am not a marketing expert. Maybe some can step up.
Kardan <kardan at riseup.net>
Encrypt your email: http://gnupg.org/documentation
Public GPG key 9D6108AE58C06558 at hkp://pool.sks-keyservers.net
fpr: F72F C4D9 6A52 16A1 E7C9 AE94 9D61 08AE 58C0 6558
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Size: 620 bytes
Desc: not available
More information about the Community